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Post by Game On on Feb 20, 2011 0:46:31 GMT 10
Hey big fella, was wondering if you were still online, go to sleep, and I doubt that I will ever recieve a LOI mate. I am the stage where I start playing 2's and supporting the clubs through bar sales.
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Post by The Puma on Feb 20, 2011 4:35:52 GMT 10
Has their actually been a whole team put in for a clearance or just innuendo?
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Post by wildpitch on Feb 21, 2011 12:02:13 GMT 10
I've seen a lot of stuff written about Monash here and have finally succumbed to replying. As a background: 25 seasons at The Farm as player / president / secretary / slave / coach of women and lower grade men's teams.
a) No juniors - we often tried to set this up, but Uni stated legal reasons they could not accept any member under age of 16. Masses amounts of paperwork when we did get a couple of 16 year olds. Having said that we deliberately did not want to go out and "steal" a team of juniors from another Club that had done the hard development work. We only tried to accept those who were pissed off with their current Club.
A "monash junior" is a 20-25 year old who has never played baseball before. We do our best to get them up to a point where it is not dangerous to themselves being on a diamond. Then they normally graduate and go interstate / overseas.
Any "good" player by our standards often decides to play summer ball and then turns winter into a "fun" season.
b) Coaches - yes they are paid. However they are employed as official staff of Uni and so lose 30% to tax. The gross amount is still less than what I have heard other coaches get as cash in hand.
c) Subsidies - have pretty much disappeared. Previously covered most of coach salary, all umpiring, half equipment, all team entry costs. This has all changed and now MUBC even pays to use own ground - like all other clubs.
d) Come and Try days. . . . Good idea. We could organise a couple of these and as the kids leave we give them the contact details for Chelt / Mulgrave / Moorabbin / Ormond as they would not be allowed to play for us anyway. (I didn't want to use sarcasm, but it appears to be a staple of all threads here.) But seriously, if the other local Clubs wanted to run a joint event near Clayton and use our ground, then go ahead and approach the Club with a proposal.
e) Junior Programme - If setting up a junior programme is as easy as everyone claims, why hasn't Chelsea and Ormond returned to A grade after dropping down in the mid-90's and not having any constraints on junior membership? I am yet to see the people calling for Monash to go up and be forced to develop, say anything about these other Clubs who dropped off the winter radar while still being good Div 2 summer clubs and have had another 15 years of juniors. What have they been doing?
Every season the Committee would have a look and see if we were meeting the needs of our member base - as I would hope all other Clubs are doing. In the 90's this resulted in us starting up Summer ball and did that for ~10yrs getting to Div 2, until the key players all went to Malvern. The remainder tried a season or two in Div 4 but folded. We added womens teams to bring Monash softballers across to the game in the original summer womens comp. In the 90's we put up signs in Japanese around campus and at Normanby House (school teaching English) to help pull in a community that was kept apart from a sport they grew up with. We tried to keep costs down as low as possible to hook in rookies, but this got tougher as subsidies ceased. Finally after 3-4 seasons of the Club (excluding chicks) winning only a couple of games, MUBC faced the prospect of the Club running out of players, and a committee. The Club needed to reluctantly drop to B grade and re-group.
Is one season in B grade enough to send them back up? Don't know. Players will come and go from the 2010 version. After a stable 90's and 00's, player turnover is high - not too surprising for rookies with no longstanding attachment to baseball who go through a couple of seasons with 1-2 wins. There are a lot of other sporting clubs at Uni to join, not to mention the Role Playing clubs where they can stay nice and dry and just pretend to be baseballers.
Personally I would lean towards a second season in B grade to make a fair assessment of the talent pool at Monash, and what the club members want their Club to be.
Monash will not be a competitive A grade Club without juniors (not allowed, and we will not try and steal them from other Clubs) or talent (we will not buy players, but will pay for a coach). Can you turn a 20-25 year old rookie into a decent A grade player by the time they are 28? I seriously doubt it. I've only just worked out what I should be doing, and my body has had enough.
A previous President made overtues to VBA and DBA that The Farm should have "access" to all Monash students playing at other winter clubs, like Melb Uni had in district cricket. I didn't agree with that. Just as I played at Monash to be with a bunch of friends, a kid who plays Chelt A2 should not be forced to Monash just because he is studying Arts there.
I hope The Farm is allowed to make the correct decision for themselves and not have others force a decision on them. By most measures we are not a "normal" club. We were formed by a bunch of visionaries who wanted to play baseball and we not happy in their existing clubs. We have welcomed any spazz (myself included) who wanted to play and learn, and have a beer or 15 after a game. Besides the early 80's when we imported (I don't think they were paid) 6x A grade flags, we have not hunted players but wait for them to come to us in respect of the hard work done by many club committees and coaches. We have spent many years at the bottom of the A grade ladder since those Al Tanner days. We will not hide in B grade. We just want to do what is best for our Club and our members. And most times they are also decisions that does not hurt baseball.
Good luck to The Farm and all other winter clubs in 2011.
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Post by The Puma on Feb 21, 2011 12:56:10 GMT 10
25 seasons and you think last year was your only in B grade. I take it they weren't consecutive.
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Post by pakkyp on Feb 21, 2011 13:03:12 GMT 10
a) No juniors - we often tried to set this up, but Uni stated legal reasons they could not accept any member under age of 16. Masses amounts of paperwork when we did get a couple of 16 year olds. So has these rules changed since last enquired? With all these other changes such as removal of subsidies, has the Uni opened things up to allow juniors now? You aren't being forced to develop juniors... it's been stated as a benefits of a junior program could have on your long term members. BTW You mentioned Ormond... bit hard to field senior sides let along juniors when they don't have a field to play out of... with the OOGH alliance apparently finished, it's possible one or both could be gone altogether... Um... you've already competed in two B grade seasons! If you won B Grade, then you should go up... regardless of your perception of your competitiveness. Sometimes life ain't fair, when Pakenham was on the cusp of collapse, with just 7 players, we were forced by the league to play in B1 grade with a number of players that would of struggled in B2, we tried to put a team on the field as often as possible and build for the following year. Stop thinking of the short term, lay the platform, recruit smartly (and it doesn't have to target other clubs... softball players already have some of the fundamentals, cricketers are just two recruiting targets) and try and build for the future not just the upcoming season. ps... do ppl actually come back for a second warm beer?
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Post by dag on Feb 22, 2011 16:47:41 GMT 10
A club that has been discussed on the forum a little has been Doncaster and their recent indifferent forum! I recently discovered what could be the reason for this form and it involves all getting together in their "jarmies" and watching "Glee". What has the world come to?
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Post by ctheballhittheball on Feb 22, 2011 21:24:32 GMT 10
gamer, as a player of the dodgers i completly dissagree with what you stated, as swearne said, yes winter is not as serous as summer. and he is right. but that dosnt mean we go out onto the diamond each week and not go hard. i enjoy playing with the dodgers, they are all great people, there is clearly nothing wrong with club as the a grade has played the last 2 grandfinals! i personally love playing with dodgers and the blokes that i play with are all top. i think it is quite unfair to putdown an entire club based on your opionin.....
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titta
Junior Member
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Post by titta on Feb 22, 2011 22:27:35 GMT 10
I have been a member at Dodgerland and enjoyed my time there.
There is a great wealth of knowledge around this club.
All you need to do is ask if you want help. There are many credited baseball people at this club.
Have some balls and don't hide on this forum.
You think you can make a difference then put your hand up.
It seems to me that there are always sharks circling around the prosperous.
If they don't want to be at an up and coming club, then you have to question the quality of the persons/people making these decisions on behalf of their kids.
Are these people, who want to leave the club, the right people to have at Berwick?
You get out of life what you put in.
The grass isn't always greener.
Let them find out.
I look forward to playing against my foes at Berwick in Winter, I would be there to help with kids if asked.
Good luck in this situation and remember, the club is always bigger than the individual.
Regards,
David Clarkson.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2011 9:21:10 GMT 10
Nice post Dave - well said mate !
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notme
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Post by notme on Feb 23, 2011 14:11:05 GMT 10
heard that monash uni r gonna play in the MWBL leavibng the DBA
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Post by player to be named on Feb 23, 2011 14:14:05 GMT 10
After only 1 season with the Dodgers Cam Ross might be a big out for Berwick this winter.
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Post by The Joker on Feb 23, 2011 14:52:45 GMT 10
heard that monash uni r gonna play in the MWBL leavibng the DBA Cool.
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Post by broohaha on Feb 23, 2011 21:59:23 GMT 10
Just thought I'd put my 2 cents worth in regarding the Berwick juniors situation - in my opinion, regardless of the lack of seriousness put on the winter competition, with all due respect to Berwick I find it a little irresponsible of coaches and the senior playing group to be disregarding juniors at training and expecting that if they (the juniors) would like to train they should ask (if this is the case)! Let's get real juniors should be nurtured and encouraged and offered the opportunity to get out on the park (after all they are one of the most important parts of the future of any club) and the seniors play a huge part as role models for the kids. For a junior to see senior players not training and drinking and playing cards just sends out the wrong message and I'm sure not many are going to ask a senior to come and train with them. Again just my opinion though but it's not surprising they are looking elsewhere to play and why change competitions when Dandenong for example is the next closest along with Pakenham. Kids can't drive themselves to training and games don't forget.
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Post by wearnie52 on Feb 23, 2011 22:27:34 GMT 10
Broohaha, there is junior training every week at Berwick in winter.
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Post by Game On on Feb 24, 2011 0:48:39 GMT 10
I totally agree with wearnie52. When I coached Juniors at berwick we organised our own training. When i said that if the kids wanted help from the seniors, it was meant in the way of extra training. The Kids are never at the club at the time that the seniors are having their team selections or nights, so they never see them drinking or playing cards. The coaches in charge of their juniors have always had trainings. I should have been more clear when making that statement, my apologies. There is a lot of experienced guys down there who would definately help with any Extra training other than the training they get from their coaches.
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Post by broohaha on Feb 24, 2011 7:42:08 GMT 10
Cheers for the clarification Game On & wearnie52, previous posts did sound a little strange.
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Post by The Joker on Feb 24, 2011 8:06:18 GMT 10
Goblin - Is there an emoticon available of one of those Smiley faces riding a bike, but going backwards? Seems it is needed all of a sudden
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Post by rube on Feb 24, 2011 9:16:40 GMT 10
i hear Monash Uni have applied to play B grade, B res & possibly 2 lower grades in MWBL..... i would have thought B grade MWBL would be pretty close to A grade DBL
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Post by Chilli Wil on Feb 24, 2011 9:42:45 GMT 10
Wow. Hope the Monash students can afford the petrol to Broadford!
So the likely teams are:
Bundoora Diamond Creek Knox La Trobe Mitchell Majors Monash Reservoir Ringwood??? Waverly Westgarth
Would be nice to have a 10 team comp and no midweek games.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2011 9:59:13 GMT 10
Are you sure about Knox CW ?
Whats Ringwood doing this year guys ?
Any other A Grade clubs going to do as Ringwood did well last year and play A and B ?
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Post by pakkyp on Feb 24, 2011 10:56:03 GMT 10
i hear Monash Uni have applied to play B grade, B res & possibly 2 lower grades in MWBL..... i would have thought B grade MWBL would be pretty close to A grade DBL The word on the street is that this might need to be moved to a different thread... www.monashuniversity.baseball.com.au/?Page=73245
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Post by stockley on Feb 24, 2011 10:57:57 GMT 10
Are you sure about Knox CW ? Whats Ringwood doing this year guys ? Any other A Grade clubs going to do as Ringwood did well last year and play A and B ? I truly hope for the sake of the competition that no other A grade clubs set up a B-grade team as well.
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Post by The Joker on Feb 24, 2011 11:23:41 GMT 10
Are you sure about Knox CW ? Whats Ringwood doing this year guys ? Any other A Grade clubs going to do as Ringwood did well last year and play A and B ? I truly hope for the sake of the competition that no other A grade clubs set up a B-grade team as well. Me too, it would be crap if club's threes started beating other clubs firsts.
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Post by lonewolf75 on Feb 24, 2011 11:24:12 GMT 10
Hey Authentic, I could only think of Watsonia, been strong in C grade for a number of years and have great club depth, and maybe GMBC, again they have always been strong in C Grade.
However for both of these clubs to be able to do this properly I think they both would require quality senior players to take the rains similar to what happened at Ringwood. There is no way that the entry into b grade by Ringwood would have worked had not the likes of J. Rogers, M Legg, D Johnson and Co. continued to play A grade.
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Post by lonewolf75 on Feb 24, 2011 11:27:41 GMT 10
i hear Monash Uni have applied to play B grade, B res & possibly 2 lower grades in MWBL..... i would have thought B grade MWBL would be pretty close to A grade DBL The word on the street is that this might need to be moved to a different thread... www.monashuniversity.baseball.com.au/?Page=73245Interesting article. I think it funny that they say it id an important MWBL anouncement but there is nothing on the MWBL website
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Post by Chilli Wil on Feb 24, 2011 11:30:43 GMT 10
I truly hope for the sake of the competition that no other A grade clubs set up a B-grade team as well. Why not? The B-Grade clubs can only get better by playing better teams. Ringwood was middle of the road last year in B Grade and won the GF in B Reserve. With Mithcell Majors coming back into B Grade from C Grade, you'd think the other 2 "big" clubs in that grade might want to test themselves, ie GMBC and Watsonia. Both clubs have the depth to mix it at that level, but if they are happy winning flags against teams that are below their skill level, good on them. Of course, any A Grade club wanting to do so would have to ask permission from the league, and they might not want all those clubs playing in there. I know the league is keen to have 10 teams, who those 10 are, I don't know.
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Post by lonewolf75 on Feb 24, 2011 11:35:25 GMT 10
At a guess CW, Waverley come down forest hills up. The other 7 from last year and add mitchell and sounds like monash. That gives us ten teams
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soap
Junior Member
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Post by soap on Feb 24, 2011 12:06:42 GMT 10
Are you sure about Knox CW ? Knox are staying in B grade
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fm2
Junior Member
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Post by fm2 on Feb 24, 2011 12:12:26 GMT 10
Is it just me ... but with all this talk of 'they should have juniors' and 'they should play A Grade' - have Monash just cracked the sh1ts and left the DBA!
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Post by pakkyp on Feb 24, 2011 12:30:52 GMT 10
Is it just me ... but with all this talk of 'they should have juniors' and 'they should play A Grade' - have Monash just cracked the sh1ts and left the DBA! I heard it was because the DBA wouldn't put up with them continually serving half frozen dim sims and warm beers...
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