2008-9 Competition Structure

Have there been any rumors of the possible restructure elements? Nothing like a bit of gossip to get a topic moving.

Minutes from the BV Presidents and Secretaries Meeting held Mon 7th of July.

Pennant Committee Report – Rod Steer asked clubs if both their President and Club coach could attend a meeting on Wednesday the 16th of July, which would review rules from the previous season as well as look at the competition structure.

Competition Structure – Peter Dihm informed clubs that discussion had taken place on a possible restructure of the competition.

In these discussions eligible criteria would still be a requirement for promotion within the Divisions.

There was also a thought to reward those clubs who are genuinely working towards developing their juniors and increasing participation numbers and to provide them with some form of protection from clubs poaching their juniors.

The structure of Division 2 would possibly change from an 8 team competition to a 10 or 12 team competition. If the competition is a 12 team competition there would be 22 games in a season, and if it was a 10 team competition their would either be a 18 or 27 game season, and Division 3 will be revamped depending on the changes to Division 2.

If the change was to go ahead there would be no promotion and relegation between Division 2 and Division 3, but the promotion and relegation system would remain between Division 1 and Division 2.

Peter Dihm informed clubs that information will be sent out to clubs regarding these possible changes, and asked if clubs could please take this information back their own club and come to the meeting on Wednesday with an answer.

I agree with lowdown in some respects. There is always talk around town that certain clubs are failing in Div 2 to comply with there "criteria" yet are still allowed to remain in Div 2. I think it is unfair to not allow a club from Div 3 to be promoted and at least be challenged to build their junior structure that year. If they fail in their attempt, then that club can be relegated back to Div 3 for a minimum of 2 years to rebuild. With some of these clubs, there may of been circumstances beyond their control as to why the didn't have this criteria. What happens if at the start of the year, they have the teams but at the end of the year, for what ever reasons, those teams have dimminished some what. The teams have done their best to have their junior teams in place. It is far easier to attract and retain players being in Div 2 as opposed to Div 3. If you have a young senior list, that have a desire to play at the higher level, they want to go and play at that level.. It seems to me that BV is allowing the strong teams to continue to get sronger while allowing the others to try and build something for the future but continualy lose players because of their place in the lower grades......I like many others believe that a change needs to be made, but not at the detriment of baseball and the players who play the game for the love of it..

i think that we should just have mainstream divisions of 10 or 12 teams in each to get more games played and more of a real competition instead of what we have now. Don't get m wrong when i say tis i think that division shows great baseball talent and should stay and division 2 isn't bad either but from div 2 down to div 3 is shocking the div 3 a grade baseball s like the thirds in div 1 thats why i am saying cut the slack have a better all rounded comp and get respect as back into the senior competition

I think the coments from a in regards to Division 3 being the equivilent of Div 1 3rds is very narrow minded.. There are a number of players that would walk into a Div 1 side, ( if they wanted to ) but choose not to due to loyalty towards the club they probably started their career at...Also, granted their are a coulple of teams that would struggle with the level of play if they were promoted, but to tar the whole division with the same brush is extremely prejudice and lacks any validity.....looking at the GF from Div 3 last year, I think would have been a great game to watch.. Obviously the two best teams from their Div got to the GF and played off....and judging by the scores, it wasnt a blowout by either team and looked like it went down to wire as it was.....It is negative attitudes by persons like yourself, that put the game on the plattau that it is on at this time....

you are talking about 2 pitchers in a whole competition. So you may have to face these pitchers once every 7 or 8 weeks.

Div 1 lets say you play Essendon, Blackburn, Doncaster, Waverley, Sunshine and then maybe even Melbourne or Cheltenham in that order - here are the pitchers you will face -

Spear, Hipke, Edwards, Davies
Wilson, Hardy, Hogan, Bright
Blewjas
Hendricks, Flemming
Wiltshire
Cassidy
Ellis, Blackley

every single one has pitched at Claxton Shield, 11 of them are ex-pro or pro.

This is why you would consider Div 3 to be considered Div 1 3rd grade.

we should diffently be playing more games. No doubt about it. 50 or 60 might be a bit much but I like your thinking.

We play far less games in victoria than the leagues in other states.

Love it Chins, not sure how long it took you to come up with it
but great idea.

50 to 60 Games- Give me a break. We are not professionals. Between work and family, you would lose most players over 25 with that structure.
Here's an idea- Make Div 1+2 both 12 team comps. They play each other twice (22 games) Thats 18 weekends and 4 mid-weeks and then Finals. SEASON OVER. Start an "elite' Midweek comp of 4 teams that play a doubleheader on rotation at Altona, Geelong, La Trobe and Doncaster. This comp can be used for Claxton and U23 selections as well as allowing Div 3 'guns' to try out against the best without deserting their club. This comp could start in late Oct. All pitchers 1 Inn. maximum so as not to muck up the main club comp. This could be 12 to 18 games long. On top of the 22 club game season this would give the signed guys and the young guns a chance to play more without making everyone play more.

I cant imagine any coach having a problem with his pitcher throwing one serious inning mid week. It is just like a bull pen which all pitchers need to do, but always find excuses not to. You might even get to throw against your own team mates to see how you would go. Better still after your 1 inning on the mound you can jump in at RF and take your hacks. You must be young and single cos I dont hear any married guys with jobs jumping at more games.

Sad to hear that view Chins. I hear the new Claxton coach is all for such a mid week comp to help pick a side and to give a tougher edge to what would normally be practice match trials.

Goodaye Chin,

Care to enlighten us to what this "separate" competition actually entails

WA league play two games every week. One games each night on a Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday and Friday and two games on a Saturday. All teams then play on a Sunday.

To make it fair, you also play the same team twice each week. This prevents one team from playing Tuesday and then coming up against a different team on the Sunday who had to play on the Saturday night.

Each club gets two x 2 game series (one home, one away) against each other club. As a result you play each team four times. 10 clubs = 36 games.

They also do 3 game series for all playoff games. As each team is used to playing 2 games every week, most can cope with the issue of depth required to win 2 out of 3 games in a week.

We can not be seen to be promoting clubs from Division 3 who finished out of the top 2. From last year Preston springs to mind. They have been actively pushing many models to try and get their club in Division 2 for this season and have been knocked back many times by the Pennant Committee.

As a player who has been in Division's 1, 2 and 3 in the last 7 years, the step between Division 2 and 3 is significant, but no where near as hard as Division 2 to Division 1. The integrity of the competition is being compromised at times with sides 9 & 10 in Division 1, but placing teams from the bottom spectrum of the lower grade into the higher grade is not going to help the club either.

The main logistical nightmare for additional games is 1) Women's competition, many clubs have womens side and having home games on both days of the weekend becomes a scheduling nightmare.

THe midweek games at the club have been a success though, my club reaps the rewards with financial gains greater than most Sundays 1sts home games and a game is always more enjoyable than training.

2) Umpire numbers - We are struggling as it is and most players will tell you the talent depth is shallow in that department once you get beyond the top 10-12.
Playing an additional 9-20 games will severely overtax our current umpires unless we get more ASAP.

More games can surely be good for the sport though, much better than the current system. But we cannot have two super leagues and a beer league for the lack of a better term for it where the rest play or the competition will not improve.