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Post by 6for8 on Jan 10, 2013 22:04:46 GMT 10
Could it possibly be right that the junior state teams will be playing in Aces branded jerseys?
Prehaps the kids would prefer to play in 'Aces' gamers and the 'Big V' doesn't resonate with the youth any longer.
I would be interested to hear the reasoning behind the step away from the traditional Victoria badge.
It doesn't sit comfortably with me.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2013 22:33:54 GMT 10
Could it possibly be right that the junior state teams will be playing in Aces branded jerseys? Prehaps the kids would prefer to play in 'Aces' gamers and the 'Big V' doesn't resonate with the youth any longer. I would be interested to hear the reasoning behind the step away from the traditional Victoria badge. It doesn't sit comfortably with me. If it is as you say 648 that doesnt make sense to me either - they are representing Victorian baseball (and would presuambly be proud to do so) and not the Aces organisation ! |
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Post by moose on Jan 11, 2013 7:15:06 GMT 10
Be a sad day for all if the "Aces" replace the Big V for state representative teams. They aren't supported by all Victorian baseball fans for a start and though I support them I don't think for a moment that they represent my state.
Also why would you rid yourselves of a automatically recognizable icon. Makes no sense.
Bet none of the other states follow suit if true.
Neil W.
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Post by bobby on Jan 11, 2013 7:26:21 GMT 10
I think it's a great idea, helps build the aces brand and give the kids some to aspire to.
Neil W.A do as their juniors are also called the Heat, S.A also do it and last year ACT followed suit.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2013 8:29:16 GMT 10
The teams are still known as Victoria Blue and Victoria White.
The Melbourne Aces is viewed as a part of the Victorian baseball pathways programme. As is proper, given that the primary purpose of the league (according to MLBI) is to "develop young Australian professionals".
bobby is correct in saying that other states have already made the connection with their ABL clubs in a similar way.
It is unfortunate that some people still take the view that there is an "us vs them" situation here (IE the governing body and the Aces working to different agendas). However that has come about, it is counter-productive to the whole concept of growing the sport and providing greater opportunities for kids.
On the basis of what we know of the Aces organisation thus far, I'd personally like to see Baseball Victoria have a far stronger connection with the club and a far greater role in its management if the ABL is to be a success.
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Post by oldmanriver on Jan 11, 2013 8:39:19 GMT 10
Having a connection with the Aces isn't all that bad. Victorian Aces has a good ring to it.
What is really really required as kc made note of is that maybe BV should take a more active role in the Aces organization and perhaps the Aces put some of that energy back into helping out the Victorian junior sides. I do think it could be a win win situation.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2013 9:03:57 GMT 10
I'm fine with the 'Victorian Aces' reference (isnt that what our Claxton Shield teams were know as back then anyway?) but perhaps I'm old school and like the idea of representing 'The Big V' rather than 'The Aces' on the Uniform ?
For me it just that I hope the Uni isnt a copy of the Aces Uni.
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Post by bobby on Jan 11, 2013 9:35:12 GMT 10
I have coached at Nationals for the past 3 years and for those 3 years I have felt the Vic teams have had the worst uniform of any team. I like the Aces theme and I think you will find that it isnt a copy of the ABL team but just the same Logo Authentic.
I really hope this is the start of a new direction with state team uniforms, if you look at any other team they get a lot more than just a playing top.
Some states you get
Playing top with your name
Hat
Batting practice shirt
Slicker/thermal jumper
Socks
Walk out Polo
Walk out Shorts
Under shirts
even kit bags
The only thing the Vic kids get is a rented playing top and a hat, I would like to see it like the old days when kids got all of the above items for a minimal cost.
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Post by oldmanriver on Jan 11, 2013 12:04:26 GMT 10
Why not just give it to them, the poor kids have to pay $2000.00 odd for the priveledge of representing the state, surely $3 or 400.00 could be allocated out of the money they have to pay regardless of whether they travel interstate or not.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2013 13:11:59 GMT 10
I think making the link too close to the Aces is either short-sighted or shows not real confidence in being able to grow our game. I mean lets go back to when we had two teams in Mleb - yeah I know it was short lived but surely any intention of growing our game includes getting back to having two ABL teams coming out of Melbourne and more than 6 teams in the National League, and if the best kids are 'raised' as products of the 'Aces' then what happens when the second team comes along  - are they the the 'poor second cousins' with less street cred ? and what is the Vic Rep teams called then and their uniform look like ? |
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Post by Spice on Jan 11, 2013 13:27:02 GMT 10
I have coached at Nationals for the past 3 years and for those 3 years I have felt the Vic teams have had the worst uniform of any team. I like the Aces theme and I think you will find that it isnt a copy of the ABL team but just the same Logo Authentic. I really hope this is the start of a new direction with national team uniforms, if you look at any other team they get a lot more than just a playing top. Some states you get Playing top with your name Hat Batting practice shirt Slicker/thermal jumper Socks Walk out Polo Walk out Shorts Under shirts even kit bags The only thing the Vic kids get is a rented playing top and a hat, I would like to see it like the old days when kids got all of the above items for a minimal cost. Back in my day as a junior (Mid to late 90's) all of the above was included in my package. We even got Mizuno cleats in U16's, which only 2 kids chose to wear at the tournament and a powerade kit bag, powerade drink bottles and towel. The kids aren't out here every week playing for the Melbourne Aces Cup, they're playing for the Baseball Victoria U** Flag. Absolute Joke! |
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Post by bobby on Jan 11, 2013 13:47:33 GMT 10
Sorry Spice is your post aimed at me? If so I am not really sure what you point is?
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Post by oldmanriver on Jan 11, 2013 14:03:07 GMT 10
authentic, just guessing if we do have two sides in the ABL, the second vic side could be called the Victorian whatevers as opposed to the Victorian Aces. Nothing would really change except for the Blue and White being replaced in name. I think at one stage the second Vic side used to be the VPBL allstar selected team which a selection criteria of having x amount of country players and x amount of city players.
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Post by bobby on Jan 11, 2013 14:17:33 GMT 10
You are correct OMR, I personally dont think we will see a 2nd Vic team in the ABL for some time. As many people have said on here we need to get the current team/organisation running smoothly before we can even think about a 2nd team.
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Post by Spice on Jan 11, 2013 14:27:37 GMT 10
Bobby,
It wasn't directly aimed at you. I was just adding a little on to your list of what kids received.
But I don't think the Vic junior teams should be called the Aces.
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Post by bobby on Jan 11, 2013 14:31:41 GMT 10
No probs just wasnt sure, I dont mind it because before the ABL the Vic Claxton team was called the Aces. it was all to do with the Aces Sporting club in keysbrough that sponsored the team.
I also remember back in the day when state teams used to get pony cleats in white...
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Post by moose on Jan 11, 2013 14:35:08 GMT 10
Firstly a thank you to Bobby. I wasn't aware of the situation in other states. I stand corrected.
I still stand on my like of the Big V rather than the Aces.
To those who remember the old ABL, should also remember that in those two sides there was only permitted four imports IIRC. Today I doubt we would have the depth of playing stock to do that and not get flogged mercilessly, if the present team is anything to go on.
Neil W
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Post by Spice on Jan 11, 2013 14:40:56 GMT 10
If everybody was allowed only 4 imports we would have one of the strongest teams on the field.
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Post by pirates on Jan 11, 2013 15:04:28 GMT 10
I have coached at Nationals for the past 3 years and for those 3 years I have felt the Vic teams have had the worst uniform of any team. I like the Aces theme and I think you will find that it isnt a copy of the ABL team but just the same Logo Authentic. I really hope this is the start of a new direction with state team uniforms, if you look at any other team they get a lot more than just a playing top. Some states you get Playing top with your name Hat Batting practice shirt Slicker/thermal jumper Socks Walk out Polo Walk out Shorts Under shirts even kit bags The only thing the Vic kids get is a rented playing top and a hat, I would like to see it like the old days when kids got all of the above items for a minimal cost. crazy situation brought in by a former VBA chief. By the way from what i have seen i think the that the 18's are using old Aces tops. Pros and cons for naming the teams after the ABL teams, I like the idea but then I also like the traditional state names. What happens if the ABL stops running will the Caxton shield team adopt the names, probably so its not a wasted excises. As for the cost of the state reps, this was proven that the savings were 0 in having the playing tops loan out and returned and the players providing their own pants ext ext ext..... ridiculous initiative at the time. If a player earns the right to represent their state then they cherish their named tops. The cost to loan out the tops was $50 a couple of years ago as a pose to new individualized named top $50 or less and the player gets to keep it. It all got very political at the time when Yoshi was doing the uniforms and someone at VBA wanted to use someone else who completely screwed up the tops the first 2 years. At the time Yoshi was doing the the uniforms for NSW and others for less than what VBA charged. In recent years the uniforms look second rate as guys have different fitting tops and pants. |
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Post by frita on Jan 11, 2013 19:31:01 GMT 10
What happens when private ownership takes over as is planed 1 day and the new owners don't like the name? Or will it be Aces forever?
This both cheapens "The Victorian" and the "Aces" brand!
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Post by mc15 on Jan 11, 2013 19:35:23 GMT 10
Was sitting on the fence until I fortunately ran into the boys in the Lakeside Oval car park when I got into work today getting ready for the bus trip to Geelong. Seeing all the young fellas wearing the Big V hats and navy blue shirts brought back a lot of very cool memories.
Just the Big V for me. Melbourne Aces/Aces sporting clubs I don't care... Keep it the way it should be. And as for names on the back of uniforms and hats... When the New York Yankees start putting them on their uniforms, we can too
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2013 19:47:29 GMT 10
What happens when private ownership takes over as is planed 1 day and the new owners don't like the name? Or will it be Aces forever? This both cheapens "The Victorian" and the "Aces" brand! Will the ABL be around long enough to go to private ownership? |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2013 20:27:57 GMT 10
What happens when private ownership takes over as is planed 1 day and the new owners don't like the name? Or will it be Aces forever? This both cheapens "The Victorian" and the "Aces" brand! Will the ABL be around long enough to go to private ownership? Ask Dihmmy ! |
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Post by perfeckt on Jan 11, 2013 22:58:14 GMT 10
For me the Big 'V' and Claxton Shield has been synonymous with amateur players reaching the top of their part time passion and I mean a passion that develops a skill set from a lifetime of dedication and desire to play at the highest amateur levels and that only takes in the top percentile of players that want to. I love the fledgling ABL and what it can do for our 'want to be' pro's but I would hate to see a schism created because the majority would only see a "professional" option as being their goal, i.e. the Aces for example in VIC., at a club level, state level, state school level? The Big V and Claxton Shield "brands" have been established for a long time and I believe that no matter how beneficial MLBi is to Oz (est: 19 century) baseball, it should create its own identity, its own trophy, its own history and be proud of it. Leave the Claxton Shield and the Big V for us, the average Joe...or Jess.
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Post by 3up3down on Jan 11, 2013 23:14:33 GMT 10
Authentic, luv it couldn't have said it better, Big V for our kids until they reach the show..whatever the name is when they get to our state show so be it...
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Post by 3up3down on Jan 11, 2013 23:16:34 GMT 10
sorry Authentic, u didn't say ANYthing of interest....my bad well said Perfect!!!!!! big few weeks GO VICS
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2013 9:17:11 GMT 10
sorry Authentic, u didn't say ANYthing of interest....my bad well said Perfect!!!!!! big few weeks GO VICS Pretty sure we are saying much the same thing - so that means you didnt say ANYthing of interest either then ! Pffftttt ! |
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Post by oldmanriver on Jan 16, 2013 12:28:35 GMT 10
Popped into Geelong yesterday while down there on business and thought I was watching a junior ABL game. Then i looked harder and saw a Queensland top with Queensland on it.
My orininal thoughts of the Victorian Aces still hold as a nick name but not having the Big V on the chest is just pure rubbish. If I want to watch the Aces play the Heat or Bite I will duck down to Altona for a look see. Bring back the Victorian uniform as it should be and leave the ABL to dress themselves. It only does cheapen the brand of Victoria and the Melbourne Aces.
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Post by mc15 on Jan 16, 2013 13:10:32 GMT 10
It only does cheapen the brand of Victoria and the Melbourne Aces. Ironically, the Vic teams wearing the Aces uniforms maybe one of the only ways you could strengthen the Aces brand... |
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Post by oldmanriver on Jan 16, 2013 13:22:28 GMT 10
Just out of curiosity, would the Aces, Heat, Bite brand names be copyrighted? If so, how much is BV paying the Melbourne Aces to use their moniker. The only reason I ask is that many years ago a southern team had to make a small alteration to their club emblem so that it was not the exact same as the original. Or is the Melbourne Aces footing the bill for the uniforms?
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- are they the the 'poor second cousins' with less street cred ? and what is the Vic Rep teams called then and their uniform look like ?
