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Post by The Joker on Jun 20, 2011 13:05:38 GMT 10
I, along with over 100 of my closest Baseball Victoria friends (thanks for all their email addresses by the way BV), have received an invite to participate in a research project to "better understand your needs as part of the baseball community". I can attend and give my view only if I am between 18 and 35 years old (I'm not). And if I can get to Ballarat or Carrum Downs late on a Sunday (I can't). Or if I am willing to give up playing baseball on Saturday July 9th to go to South Melbourne (I'm not). A potentially good idea, but doomed to failure before it starts? Baseball Victoria in partnership with The Research Team (led by Dr Sheila N Nguyen, Deakin University) are working together to better understand your needs as part of the baseball community. We would like to hear from you and for your participation you will be given a token of our appreciation. All we need is your time and perspective as a participant within Baseball Victoria’s system. Specifically, we would like to get your thoughts on how to improve your experience in baseball. Please choose one of the following times and register your interest at BaseballVicResearch@gmail.com noting the appropriate focus group date/time.
Please note that the focus groups will be approximately 1.5 hours and are segmented into three groups:
1. participants who play on representative teams between the age bracket of 18-35 (with at least 2 years in this capacity);
2. participants who play on recreational teams between the age bracket of 18-35 (with at least 2 years in this capacity); and
3. any participants between the age bracket of 18-35. Please choose according to your experience.
Focus Group 1 (representative, 18-35 years of age): Sunday 3rd July 4:30pm – 6:30pm, Ballarat Baseball Club.
Focus Group 2 (recreational, 18-35 years of age): Saturday 9th July 10:30 – 12:30pm, Sports House, South Melbourne 3206.
Focus Group 3 (all members, 18-35 years of age): Sunday 17th July 4:30pm – 6:30 pm, Carrum Downs Baseball Club.
Thank you for your consideration and please RSVP by July 1st, 2011 with Anwen Pattison at BaseballVicResearch@gmail.com; the research team will confirm your focus group details via email. We look forward to meeting you in person!
Baseball Victoria and The Research Team.
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Post by berwickboy on Jun 20, 2011 13:14:10 GMT 10
A good idea poorly executed in my eyes, why not do an online survey, I'd much rather spend a spare 10 minutes on my computer filling it out that 2 1/2 hours (with travel time) going to one of these.
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Post by wako on Jun 20, 2011 22:51:18 GMT 10
Blind. Carbon. Copy.
For fvck's sake, how hard is it?
Also, sending an "official" email from a gmail account, when the organisation you represent has its own domain name looks very sus.
By the way, if any of you were considering using this list to send unsolicited email of a commercial nature ("spam"), don't. It's bad manners, PR, and punishable by fine after investigation by the communications regulator.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2011 23:35:09 GMT 10
18 - 35 hey TJ...that rules me out which is fortunate as I wouldnt want my email address splashed around either.
I think I like the intention which I assume is for the betterment of the game in Victoria but I dont get the age group rationale.
I, like others contributed to the on-line survey last year and got zero feedback nor any indication as to findings/ideas etc, so maybe its less offensive to not be asked in the first place than to be asked and perhaps ignored ?
It would be great if BV put something up (even herein) that explained this a bit that may lead to support not cynisism of the 'project' objective (whatever it may be) ?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2011 1:38:01 GMT 10
18 - 35 hey TJ...that rules me out which is fortunate as I wouldnt want my email address splashed around either. I think I like the intention which I assume is for the betterment of the game in Victoria but I dont get the age group rationale. I, like others contributed to the on-line survey last year and got zero feedback nor any indication as to findings/ideas etc, so maybe its less offensive to not be asked in the first place than to be asked and perhaps ignored ? It would be great if BV put something up (even herein) that explained this a bit that may lead to support not cynisism of the 'project' objective (whatever it may be) ? Even still Authentic, how many baseballers State-wide are going to drive to Ballarat to do this Research project? 2 hours in Ballarat, plus at least an hour drive each way (from Melb) on a Sunday night... |
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Post by pakkyp on Jun 21, 2011 8:32:49 GMT 10
Blind. Carbon. Copy. For fvck's sake, how hard is it? Also, sending an "official" email from a gmail account, when the organisation you represent has its own domain name looks very sus. By the way, if any of you were considering using this list to send unsolicited email of a commercial nature ("spam"), don't. It's bad manners, PR, and punishable by fine after investigation by the communications regulator. Good luck tracking down the culprit.... This reminds me of an incident last year. A DBA club sent an email to the association clubs and it's members about the finals being held at that club. Well instead of using bcc all club members email addresses where on display for all and sundry. Rumor has it that a prankster got a hold of this list and started signing up the members to a shemale porn site, but gave up after the first 6 email addresses came back as already being registered with that site. |
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Post by flip on Jun 21, 2011 8:59:45 GMT 10
Interesting the age bracket here - I would say that a very good % of people that are running/coaching many of the clubs around Vic above this age bracket. Surely they have some good ideas/opinions about baseball.
Ballarat - interesting selection of location - yes they have baseball, clubs and interested parties, but not one of our thriving areas.
KC - that leaves you out of the research project - not quite in the age bracket...
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Post by mc15 on Jun 21, 2011 9:05:38 GMT 10
So if BV doesn't make an attempt to get feedback from it's members it's rubbished on the forum... And now when they try to do it face to face (which I think is better as it allows people to expand on their views) they get rubbished.
Go figure... I guess there is no pleasing some people...
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Post by 4crownies on Jun 21, 2011 9:14:22 GMT 10
Blind. Carbon. Copy. For fvck's sake, how hard is it? Also, sending an "official" email from a gmail account, when the organisation you represent has its own domain name looks very sus. By the way, if any of you were considering using this list to send unsolicited email of a commercial nature ("spam"), don't. It's bad manners, PR, and punishable by fine after investigation by the communications regulator. Too late by the looks of my inbox |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2011 10:01:53 GMT 10
I'm only surmising, but I reckon this might be just one stage of the project. I doubt that any interested group or individidual will be knowingly ignored, though it would be handy to have had it explained if that was the case.
The 18-35 year-old range is where the greatest number of senior members with a projected playing future in the game is concentrated. It makes good sense to speak to them about their needs and expectations if they are to be kept positively engaged, possibly for ten, twenty or more years to come.
Sure, there are plenty of Masters age and non-playing persons who are still actively involved - and still have views on what might be good for the game. However, their needs and expectations may be somewhat different.
Having eighteen year-olds and sixty year-olds in a focus group might be an interesting exercise in inter-generational exchange, but it is unlikely to result in much commonality if an accurate picture of the needs and priorities of any particular demographic is to be developed. Hard for the focus group to have any focus, I would have thought.
I like the idea, though I can understand the concern about timing and venues. Plenty of people play, coach or are otherwise occupied during Saturday and Sunday. If they cannot make it to any of the sessions, surely there could be an alternative way of providing input.
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Post by stuartcapel on Jun 21, 2011 10:06:58 GMT 10
Blind. Carbon. Copy. For fvck's sake, how hard is it? Also, sending an "official" email from a gmail account, when the organisation you represent has its own domain name looks very sus. By the way, if any of you were considering using this list to send unsolicited email of a commercial nature ("spam"), don't. It's bad manners, PR, and punishable by fine after investigation by the communications regulator. Too late by the looks of my inbox No dramas 4C, just click the unsubscribe tab. Seemed to work for Pakkyp! ;D |
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Post by The Puma on Jun 21, 2011 10:12:09 GMT 10
Nah, he loves it.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2011 16:16:10 GMT 10
At the risk of this becoming another of those arguments where if you have a view contrary to BV's or an opinion that might actually have some merit that may differ from BV's that you are 'rubbishing/bagging' BV..........
Wouldnt you say MC15 that it really is as simple as BV putting something on the website explaining (albeit in brief form) the process and intended objectives, thus encouraging our confidence in the process rather than being left in the dark and having to guess what the point of it all is ?
Clearly we all have the best interests of the sport in mind so it aught not be that difficult.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2011 16:39:21 GMT 10
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Post by Marshy on Jun 21, 2011 17:12:25 GMT 10
Do the forum members think the targeting of the 18-35 year old demographic specifically excludes some of the most important people in the game, and a potential plethora of untapped ideas, information and experience.
I am thinking coaches, committees, support personnel and parents. Not to mention every ex-ABL player.
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Post by stuartcapel on Jun 21, 2011 17:30:38 GMT 10
Do the forum members think the targeting of the 18-35 year old demographic specifically excludes some of the most important people in the game, and a potential plethora of untapped ideas, information and experience. I am thinking coaches, committees, support personnel and parents. Not to mention every ex-ABL player. I think a handful of ex-ABL players just aged!!  |
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Post by splitfinger on Jun 21, 2011 17:54:20 GMT 10
Blind. Carbon. Copy. For fvck's sake, how hard is it? Also, sending an "official" email from a gmail account, when the organisation you represent has its own domain name looks very sus. By the way, if any of you were considering using this list to send unsolicited email of a commercial nature ("spam"), don't. It's bad manners, PR, and punishable by fine after investigation by the communications regulator. I can't believe BV would be so incredibly careless as to allow email addresses of members to be made (somewhat) public. Feedback point number 1 BV: protect the privacy of your long suffering members at all costs. That is completely unprofessional. Bit hard to maintain integrity when you do something like that. Anyway.... any forum members looking to attend? Would be interested to know what the 'token of appreciation'is. |
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Post by wako on Jun 21, 2011 19:24:22 GMT 10
So if BV doesn't make an attempt to get feedback from it's members it's rubbished on the forum... And now when they try to do it face to face (which I think is better as it allows people to expand on their views) they get rubbished. Go figure... I guess there is no pleasing some people... Nobody complained about the concept of getting feedback face to face. Pretend this was your job. Would you open-CC over 100 people from a gmail account? |
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Post by mc15 on Jun 21, 2011 19:27:10 GMT 10
At the risk of this becoming another of those arguments where if you have a view contrary to BV's or an opinion that might actually have some merit that may differ from BV's that you are 'rubbishing/bagging' BV.......... Wouldnt you say MC15 that it really is as simple as BV putting something on the website explaining (albeit in brief form) the process and intended objectives, thus encouraging our confidence in the process rather than being left in the dark and having to guess what the point of it all is ? Clearly we all have the best interests of the sport in mind so it aught not be that difficult. There are ways and means of requesting clarification if its not given. And I'm not questioning whether the process should be better. I question how well some have done this again on the forum... Which leads me to a broader issue that you bring up. I actually question whether some of the people who comment on this forum do "have the best interests of the sport in mind." It's a one liner that's easy to hide behind when you want to have a crack at someone. There are certainly comments that appear here which are not in the best interest of the sport in creating a collaborative approach. I was just talking to a couple very well respected people today within our sport who have given up reading the forum due to the negativity and cheap shots that can float round on here from time to time. It's not everyone, but there are enough. For what it's worth, my idea of getting to the root of a problem, whether it be through poor communication or flat our disagreement with a direction or administration/coaching/selection whatever, is to actually get in touch with the people involved and offer direct feedback or a contribution to help fix the problem. So my question to the readers who have gotten this far into my dribble... How many of you directly called/emailed/discussed personally with someone at BV about the problems with the survey or its distribution? If you did, hats off to you because that's how you solve the problem. O.K those of you who wish can start your abuse of me now |
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Post by mc15 on Jun 21, 2011 19:32:07 GMT 10
So if BV doesn't make an attempt to get feedback from it's members it's rubbished on the forum... And now when they try to do it face to face (which I think is better as it allows people to expand on their views) they get rubbished. Go figure... I guess there is no pleasing some people... Nobody complained about the concept of getting feedback face to face. Pretend this was your job. Would you open-CC over 100 people from a gmail account? 2nd line of your first post is exactly what I'm talking about Wako |
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Post by wako on Jun 21, 2011 19:36:17 GMT 10
Nobody complained about the concept of getting feedback face to face. Pretend this was your job. Would you open-CC over 100 people from a gmail account? 2nd line of your first post is exactly what I'm talking about Wako Yes, precisely: a criticism (eminently justifiable) of the implementation details, nothing to do with the idea of getting face-to-face feedback. |
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Post by dag on Jun 21, 2011 19:56:37 GMT 10
I appreciate everything people are saying on here but Blah....Blah.....Blah!!
This will be another smoke and mirrors attempt at trying to show the baseball public that somebody is doing a job. As Jack Elliot said "pigs ar5e".
I was told by BV that this was an 18 month process and this just the beginning.
Any useful information will be lost in time and stupidity.
What clue would an 18 year old have in how to improve baseball here, all he has dreamt of for the last 5 years is a pro contract in USA or thoughts of college.
Top age 35, of course that's when people start thinking about life after playing (committe's or coaching) what would they know???
How about BV focus on the 50 odd kids unfinancial from recent Nationals (this happens each year) and get the little things right, because there is nothing proactive being done regarding this issue??
Every forum member and baseball lover is being played for a sucker by unqualified people bluffing their way along!!
I wouldn't do this even if asked, it smacks of paying somebody else to tell them how to run the game (do their job in the future).
As I have said before......MONKEY'S
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2011 22:50:48 GMT 10
Yes, MC15, there is the occasional cheap shot and there are some not very helpful comments that might appear on Forum pages. Probably not as often as a couple of years ago, as the Forum has become self-regulating to a reasonable degree. Moderators are well aware that things are sometimes said (or written) in a moment of pique, under the veil of anonymity or in a context where not enough information is known. It is after all a public Forum, where the bad has to be expected with the good. I'm not quite sure where you are going with the comment about "very well respected people" in the sport giving up on the Forum (though I don't like what it is implying). That's their prerogative, but its smacks of elitism and selectivity to me. This is a warts and all baseball place that has survived and has grown for three years. It has continued to meet some sort of need that no other Aussie baseball organisation had the courage to take on. No-one knew where it might lead. It is sometimes a pain in the ass keeping a lid on some of the issues and comments, but on balance the Forum has - in my opinion - done far more good than harm. It has given baseball people a voice, it has provided a vehicle to disseminate news and information and it has drawn some creative and insightful comment on a whole range of baseball issues. It has enabled people to get things off their chest, even though it has occasionally produced comment and inference bordering on being defamatory and/or offensive, especially when people choose to have a crack at someone or something. It would be nice for us to be nice all of the time. Like you, MC15, we certainly encourage people to be positive and proactive in the ways that they go about addressing perceived problems. But this IS a Forum - nothing more and nothing less. It does not pretend to offer a "collaborative" approach to real or perceived issues and changes required in the sport. There are people who get paid to do that. BV and its consultants are being paid - among other things - to undertake the Research Project and to put the Strategic Plan into effect. Let's help encourage people "who have the best interests of the sport in mind" to avail themselves of any opportunity to provide input. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2011 23:55:32 GMT 10
MC15 I appreciate your thoughts and we are both entitled to our opinions, which probably are not to far removed from each other to be honest as I too tire sometimes of the negativity that gets thrown around herein.
But the reality is the negativity and/or cynisism pointed at whomever to do with whatever often has a basis upon which it occurs, and if its just a rant I just read on or have a laugh to be honest, unless there truly is something to be learned from a particular rant or expression.
And just for the record I have had repeated direct communications with BV in organising a team last Summer and it didnt go well (and had me reconsider my involvement there for a while) but rather than get all bitter and twisted about it I remain optimistic that some good eventually may come of the matters discussed and next season 'things will be better'.
For better or for worse I like that the Forum remains fairly organic and I am firmly of the view that most herein post with the view to 'contributing' and perhaps hoping someone is listening and that our sport grows through the open and honest exchange of views from everyone that loves our game (including the many of us that contribute herein).
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Post by mc15 on Jun 22, 2011 8:47:34 GMT 10
KC and authentic, you both make very good and valid points. And I can't disagree with any of those points you have made. Perhaps I can clarify my view more clearly with the following.
It is easy to identify a problem, it is hard to solve a problem. The more people who are proactive and inclusive with all involved (players, clubs, administrators, forum members, BV, ABF etc, etc) the more likely we are to find solutions. The question I ask is that if they feel so strongly about issues within baseball in Australia that they feel they need to share their views in such strong terms here on the firum, that they follow it up with action rather than just poking with a stick from afar.
Autherntic, I've approached BV and other clubs offering help on issues over the years. Sometimes the help is accepted, sometimes not... Sometimes they ask to just wait and see. But all you can do is offer which is brilliant in itself.
KC. the reference to "very well respected people" has no undertone of elitism and selectivity at all. The people who I am talking about have been round baseball for a number of years and the choose not to read the forum do to my comments in previous posts. No need to read between the lines on that one. PM me if you want further clarification
Cheers
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Post by Spice on Jun 22, 2011 16:58:21 GMT 10
Nobody said the e-mail came FROM a gmail account. Perhaps it did, but nobody has stated that, only assumed it. It asks you to RSVP to a gmail account. This will be because the people doing the survey are from outside of BV, from Deakin Uni in fact.
Now that I've stated the facts, I don't agree with it either. BCC people, don't give out their info. It's against BV's Code of Conduct relating to Privacy.
Make the times realistic.
Make the venues realistic. Ballarat is a joke for rep players. How many rep players are in or around Ballarat? Stuff all!
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Post by wako on Jun 22, 2011 17:15:20 GMT 10
Nobody said the e-mail came FROM a gmail account. Perhaps it did, but nobody has stated that, only assumed it. It asks you to RSVP to a gmail account. This will be because the people doing the survey are from outside of BV, from Deakin Uni in fact. I received one; the source address is a gmail.com address and it came from someone logged into gmail's web interface, whereupon it relayed through a couple of internal google mail servers and landed in my inbox. Other than perhaps a nominal service charge from your hosting provider, email addresses are essentially free, and if that were not possible, it could be sent by a BV person from their own account with the gmail RSVP address. That would lend a little more credibility and trustworthiness. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2011 21:39:01 GMT 10
Interested persons will by now have seen this link/entry on the Baseball Victoria website. vicresearch.baseball.com.au/It's clear that managers of the Research Project are keen to invite feedback from all sections of the Victorian baseball community. Who'd like to to lead off?  |
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Post by Camov on Jul 15, 2011 10:28:39 GMT 10
im sorry guys but once you hit 35 your pretty much senile and your opinions no longer carry any weight.
;-)
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Post by Spice on Jul 15, 2011 12:07:03 GMT 10
Can these tools please stop sending me e-mails. I'm getting them every second day, it's getting beyond a joke.
Irritating people isn't the way to get them to help you out.
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