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Post by oldnotstupid on Feb 21, 2018 21:30:17 GMT 10
-------- Original message --------
From: Kelsey Quinn <Kelsey.Quinn@baseballvictoria.com.au>
Date: 21/2/18 18:18 (GMT+10:00)
To:
Cc: Jeff Paull <Jeff.Paull@baseballvictoria.com.au>, Samantha Creed <samantha.creed@baseballvictoria.com.au>, Les Flower <Les.Flower@baseballvictoria.com.au>, Justin Huber <Justin.Huber@baseballvictoria.com.au>
Subject: Non-National Situation
Dear Club Presidents and Secretaries,
Baseball Victoria has been working through concerns raised by many clubs in regards to non-national players at some clubs. A player from the Melbourne Baseball Club has been mentioned many times and subsequently an investigation commenced.
We have conducted a thorough investigation of the matters raised and appreciate the effort from all of those who have provided evidence and made statements. BV is looking to continue to maintain the integrity of the competition very seriously.
The investigation has taken longer to complete than we had hoped as BV is required to follow due process, afford natural justice and a provide right of reply to respondents.
It is for this reason that it has taken some time to come to a conclusion.
After consideration of all the evidence and statements presented, BV has determined that the Melbourne player, Sam Boone, meets the criteria to be classified as a ‘national’ player. We have come to this decision based on Sam’s history here in Australia, his intent for being in Australia and that he has lived here full time for multiple years.
Although he is not a citizen or resident, he has been here for more than 6 months prior to the season.
Concern was raised that he did leave the country just prior to the season starting. BV has accepted that this was a requirement for his study and he has done this with the intent of remaining a resident in Australia.
We will be proposing at a future P&S meeting this rule to be re-worded to avoid similar situations in the future.
Regards,
Kelsey Quinn
Competitions Coordinator
Melbourne Aces | Baseball Victoria
_
p: +61 (03) 9645 8000 m: +61 429 447 958
a: Sports House, Level 2 / 375 Albert Road, Albert Park
w: MelbourneAces.com.au / BaseballVictoria.com.au
e: Kelsey.quinn@baseballvictoria.com.au
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Post by wyatt33 on Feb 22, 2018 7:05:40 GMT 10
Is this a precedent? Does this open up the rest of the league to try and manipulate the system even more?
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Post by oldnotstupid on Feb 22, 2018 10:43:39 GMT 10
Is this a precedent? Does this open up the rest of the league to try and manipulate the system even more? The rule is black and white. 98) Non-National Players a) A player will be deemed ‘non-national’ if they are not an Australian Citizen or Permanent Resident or have not continuously resided in Australia for the six months immediately prior to the commencement of the season in which a Club wishes to register them as a player. A look up of any dictionary of your choice will list the meaning of the word "continuously" as "uninterruptedly, non-stop etc" If said player left the country for whatever reason that means that they do not qualify for exemption to the rule. Just because the person maybe a good guy with the right intentions, this does not give him or their club the right to flout the playing conditions. Ignorance is not a defence. To all the other clubs, go ahead and flout the rules to your hearts content as this ruling sets the precedence for all playing condition breaches of the future. |
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Post by stuartcapel on Feb 22, 2018 11:12:28 GMT 10
From the Competitions Co-ordinator's email, I notice the following:
"Although he is not a citizen or resident..."
This is followed by:
"...with the intent of remaining a resident in Australia."
To 'remain' a resident, you'd have to be one now. Maybe 'obtain residency' would have been more appropriate.
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Post by baseless on Feb 22, 2018 11:50:52 GMT 10
"Just because the person maybe a good guy with the right intentions, this does not give him or their club the right to flout the playing conditions. Ignorance is not a defence."
But it is OLDIE, if you have huge financial backing and QC legal backing! It is now open season on how many rules you can disregard!
"Integrity of the Competition" as long as the teflon club gets its way!
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Post by slypig on Feb 22, 2018 13:30:07 GMT 10
These rules are terrible by BV, the way i read and have always understood the rule (part 6, 98, d) "no new non-national player registrations will be accepted after the 1st of December each year."
well this is exactually whats happened with a team in Div 2. non national arrived in Australia on the 4th december (have proof and confirmed by a said someone who was up there in BV at the time). so id love to know how you register a player not in the country because my understanding is they also have to be in the country by the 1st of December also (which has been confirmed true from BV them self) so how he has been allowed to play is beyond me!
Rules are pretty black and white yet a whole lot of exploiting going on.
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Post by The Puma on Feb 22, 2018 15:30:39 GMT 10
Talking to a couple of StKilda guys after the game on Saturday and they have more than one non-national player in their firsts team (the guy said 3). It was explained that because they were walk ups here for work and study and not guys imported to play for the club that the rule didn't apply.
That makes perfect sense but it's not what the rule says. Maybe that should be looked at for next season too.
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Post by philniekro on Feb 22, 2018 20:15:53 GMT 10
Please, there is a hidden agenda here. why was this only bought up 4 weeks ago and not the start of the season. Is it because other clubs were trying hard to get an easy way into the finals as Melbourne baseball club the way I see it, have been the best club by far this season.. My understanding is that the player mentioned, has played over 190 games for 2 clubs in Melbourne. His study/work takes him to far away places that I only dream of visiting.. so everyone get off your high horse and get on with the game.. and as I know it, no QC has ever been spoken to
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Post by philniekro on Feb 22, 2018 20:17:41 GMT 10
And just look at all the pros that have come back and played ball for their club at times.. the say they are from Melbourne Australia...someone tell me what the difference is there
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Post by baseless on Feb 23, 2018 9:17:21 GMT 10
No hidden agenda PHIL. This was raised in Dec but the admin was too busy selling tickets to Aces games to worry about the local comp. The 190 gamer you speak of is NOT the issue. It is his status as a local that allows Melb to bring in a paid pitcher, when the same status was taken away from a Geelong player so they CAN'T have an import. Level playing field? Finally the difference with home grown pros that come back and play is simple. They are Australian citizens.
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Post by oldnotstupid on Feb 23, 2018 10:32:30 GMT 10
All Melbournes results this season should have this preceding them.
*
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Post by philniekro on Feb 23, 2018 15:55:17 GMT 10
Whatever oldnotstupid you idiot.. just to let you know, the player in question actually had no impact on games until around 2018. I think he missed the first 6 games, maybe more. I am not sure.. and he wasn't hitting until at least Late December. decision done. move on and stop whinging
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Post by philniekro on Feb 23, 2018 15:57:50 GMT 10
Once again Baseless, why only recently has this been raised. why not start of season, why not last year or the year before that.. thats the question that should be raised. and I wasn't talking about your club..
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Post by philniekro on Feb 23, 2018 15:58:06 GMT 10
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Post by oldnotstupid on Feb 24, 2018 12:34:02 GMT 10
Whatever oldnotstupid you idiot.. just to let you know, the player in question actually had no impact on games until around 2018. I think he missed the first 6 games, maybe more. I am not sure.. and he wasn't hitting until at least Late December. decision done. move on and stop whinging He missed the 1st couple of weeks. Online BV stats shows he played in 4th game. Whether he had any "impact" is irrelevant in the scheme of things. |
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Post by philniekro on Feb 24, 2018 17:48:23 GMT 10
I think you may just need to get a life and stop worrying about everyone else.....
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Post by fuzzy on Feb 24, 2018 18:37:45 GMT 10
Clubs abiding by the rules and BV enforcing those rules as they stand at this time might be the the best way to go. It's not rocket science.
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Post by philniekro on Feb 25, 2018 7:21:52 GMT 10
I agree Fuzzy, but my question stands.. why now. why not at the start of the year, why not last year or the year before that..Thats all
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Post by russelledwards on Feb 25, 2018 14:08:47 GMT 10
Some of the geriatrics on the Foum may remember the first Season of Summer Baseball being the main Season in 1976/77. We (Essendon) coached by Robert Rowan were in third place on the ladder after beating Preston in the next to last game of the year. Preston protested (as was their right) over one of our players who had played with Preston years before in the lower grades and had never been cleared from them to us. He came to us via Lalor I think.
We lost the points from all our wins when the guy played, went from third to second last and had to beat University in the last game of the year to avoid becoming the first Essendon Team to be relegated to Division 2. Thankfully only one team went down in those days.
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Post by The Puma on Feb 25, 2018 15:27:14 GMT 10
Rules are rules and they are black and white in this case. There should be no room for judgements by BV staff. If the rule is wrong it’s up to clubs to fix it in the off season. Timing is irrelevant.
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